Hi,

not sure if i have posted under the correct forum topic?

i am new to 4WD Trips and have noticed every trip I have seen posted requires that vehicles always seem to be request to have winches fitted to vehicles.

I have been in a 4WD club for the last three years and have down numerous trips in a variety of conditions inching mud and snow. I have not had a winch in that time and fortunately have only been recovered three times, that I can remember. Snatched twice and winched  out once. I have every intention of getting a winch when the budget allows and fully appreciate having a winch fitted as insurance. I was just wondering if capable vehicles and experience could be taken into consideration for trips rather than being discouraged by seeing "Winch required" in the trips being posted.

look forward to hearing your thoughts 

No, they are not required on all trips. Anything Medium-Hard or Hard it is mandatory, anything less than that it is discretionary by the trip leader.

I'd be suggesting that any trip that is rated as Easy or Easy-Medium really should not have a requirement of having a winch. Recommended is fine but mandatory is a bit over the top and trip leaders might need to have a bit of a think before restricting who can join the trip. The only reason I could think of a winch being an absolute necessity on easier trips is if in the route there are some very narrow and windy tracks that have been planned where there is no possible way of snatching a vehicle through.

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Hi Paul
The answer is no. 100% agree with Winston. I understand that winch is not cheap but they are not expensive either. When you go 4wding without a winch, it can be difficult to recover you in some tricky situation. Let me give you an example. Last week I help run an easy trip. I was the last car so I can assist on recoveries. The last track turned out to be more wet and difficult then expected and turning around was not an option. A few cars without winch got stuck. They need to rely on the car in front to pull them out. Unfortunately it was a slippery track with little bit off camber. So when the lead car tried to snatch the car behind, it actually pulled the car at the front sideway and put it into a bad spot. Luckily the lead car could winch himself out.

What I am trying to say is that winching is always the safest option as you can perform recoveries slowly and in a controlled speed.

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Just to add on the cost factor - the 4wdSupacentre winches are excellent value and a great option for the avg 4wd enthusiast. Runva and Warn are better quality and if you plan on doing extreme tracks regularly then spend the extra. If it's just to get you out of trouble once in a while then the Grande Mk III and Domin8or are perfect for less than $400. A bull bar with winch mounts is the expensive bit. Installation of a winch is extremely easy.

Remember, just about every mod on a 4wd will potentially get you into trouble, but a winch will get you out of trouble.

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If you look at some of the latest trips available, including the snow trip I am running.. they don't have winch requirement. In my trip I said winch recommended but not required. If no winch, recovery gear and recovery points are a must.

Winch is awesome to have just in the worst case scenario, so far I never used mine but it's always good to have. Like Winston said, 4wdsupacentre ones are excellent value for money if your budget is limited. A lot of trip leaders probably list it as required just thinking ahead for a worse case scenario and sometimes tracks can turn from easy to hard if it rains a bit.. so a winch requirement is more of an insurance.

Haivng said that, a lot of people on here are quite reasonable so if there is an easy trip and you'd like to go - you can always ask for the trip leader to check out your setup and if there is going to be a convoy of 8 cars and everyone has a winch except you, he might still give you the go ahead to join as there will be plenty of help if needed in worst case.

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Paul, am sure there are many on this site who possibly have similar views to you in regard to 'winch required'. As Winston said, Kelvin has set the trip ratings and anything that is 'medium/hard' or hard requires a winch, which I agree 100% with. (Agree with Winston in that we do need a 'extreme' rating...). Most of the 'easy/medium' trips are designed for members who are relatively new to 4wding and/or dont require vehicles to be modified or have accessories fitted etc. Generally most of these trips fill very quickly, as you have probably noticed.

In saying all of that, it is up to the Trip Leader to decide what he or she wants as minimum vehicle requirements for their trip and that should be respected. I have seen many people sign up or express interest for a trip when their vehicle does not meet the minimum requirements that the trip leader has stipulated. By the same token, at the risk of upsetting some, there are trip leaders who will rate a trip as 'easy/medium' based on their own vehicle setup and experience when a novice with a standard vehicle may find it a little daunting and well beyond the 'easy' rating.

Trip ratings is always open to interpretation, but my opinion is a easy trip is when low range is rarely required, basically just driving on gravel roads. Once low range is required for over 60% of the terrain being driven, medium rating at least & higher if needed, depending on what other tracks maybe included in the trip. What also needs to be considered is 'worst case scenario' in that whilst some tracks maybe quiet easy in dry conditions, this can quickly change in wet weather, as Kelvin mentioned about his last trip.  Kelvin & others who replied have said, a winch is probably the best recovery item you can have and once again, it is up to the Trip Leader to decide. Is always better to be 'safe rather than sorry' and if a Trip Leader requires participants to have a winch, even if it is a so called 'easy/medium' trip, that is his/her prerogative even if some dont agree.

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You don't need a so called winch bar $1200+.You buy a winch plate $50-$70 and high tensile bolts. That bolts to the front chassis rails and  then cut a slot in the bull bar for the hawser and cable/rope.

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